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Post by Frederick the Great on Feb 2, 2020 17:50:01 GMT
Speaking of this game, anyone got any info on how many vessels the royal navy had in the Med? I can't find anything on it on Wikipedia and the one list of all vessels in WW2 (Allied or Axis) is absolutely massive (on Wikipedia)
Work on Axis Navy is done btw
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Post by Tolbethessar on Feb 2, 2020 19:33:05 GMT
Was just watching a documentary about tank battles, "Greatest Tank Battles". Funny, the episode for El Alamein is now up next. Rommel vs Monty. I'm going to enjoy it.  The YouTube channel or something else? I saw a video of the Gulf War's greatest tank battle (72 Easting) of the same name, Greatest Tank Battles. Prime Video. I have Prime anyway, so might as well use it once a while. |
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Post by Tolbethessar on Feb 2, 2020 19:37:55 GMT
Speaking of this game, anyone got any info on how many vessels the royal navy had in the Med? I can't find anything on it on Wikipedia and the one list of all vessels in WW2 (Allied or Axis) is absolutely massive (on Wikipedia) Work on Axis Navy is done btw Well for USA in the Vietnam war, I had the exact same problem. But I was able to get a rough idea of how USA's Navy think (based on modern placements of their numbered fleets, the US 6th fleet is based in Naples, Italy and is responsible for the Mediterranean during the Cold War and onward, for example). en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Sixth_FleetNow... the Royal Navy doesn't quite think exactly the same way, but America inherited the "Global Naval responsibility" from the British, and a lot of the American naval bases are former British naval bases. If you could have two maps and lay one down on top of the other, they overlap almost the same major routes, etc. Warning: I can't promise the Caribbean, NW Europe (where UK is), and the American coasts would be anywhere remotely similar. It's because those areas border the homelands of one or other and they have very different deployment/basing structures depending on whose home it is, make sense. Adding one more thing (this is the 3rd edit actually)... en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fleetsYou can look at how navies organized their ships into fleets, this may be quite helpful. Xakire probably has some additional information? I haven't really spoken with him, and he had wanted to be left alone anyhow. Back to the fleet thing, apparently mainly the USN, Germans, and the Japanese ever bothered to number some of their fleets or all of their fleets (USN). |
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Post by Frederick the Great on Feb 2, 2020 20:30:34 GMT
You know what, idea.
The Commonwealth didn't have as many ships at the start of the Second World War anyway as compared to the Italian Navy, and since I'm balancing the game anyway for both sides I'm making both the Navies of the same size (just like the Air Forces and Armies).
The Naval Commanders (Axis and Allied) can name the ships the way they want. But they're gonna be the exact same number of ships, of the exact types (so for example, each side has 4 battleships in total, no more, no less, unless otherwise stated).
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Post by Frederick the Great on Feb 2, 2020 20:32:22 GMT
Speaking of this game, anyone got any info on how many vessels the royal navy had in the Med? I can't find anything on it on Wikipedia and the one list of all vessels in WW2 (Allied or Axis) is absolutely massive (on Wikipedia) Work on Axis Navy is done btw Well for USA in the Vietnam war, I had the exact same problem. But I was able to get a rough idea of how USA's Navy think (based on modern placements of their numbered fleets, the US 6th fleet is based in Naples, Italy and is responsible for the Mediterranean during the Cold War and onward, for example). en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Sixth_FleetNow... the Royal Navy doesn't quite think exactly the same way, but America inherited the "Global Naval responsibility" from the British, and a lot of the American naval bases are former British naval bases. If you could have two maps and lay one down on top of the other, they overlap almost the same major routes, etc. Warning: I can't promise the Caribbean, NW Europe (where UK is), and the American coasts would be anywhere remotely similar. It's because those areas border the homelands of one or other and they have very different deployment/basing structures depending on whose home it is, make sense. Adding one more thing (this is the 3rd edit actually)... en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fleetsYou can look at how navies organized their ships into fleets, this may be quite helpful. Xakire probably has some additional information? I haven't really spoken with him, and he had wanted to be left alone anyhow. Back to the fleet thing, apparently mainly the USN, Germans, and the Japanese ever bothered to number some of their fleets or all of their fleets (USN). I checked the List of Fleets and saw the Mediterranean Fleet article, opened that article only to get stuck in the same problem again (how many ships were in the fleet?) so I "created" a solution for it out of necessity. Can't search forever. |
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Post by Tolbethessar on Feb 2, 2020 21:11:58 GMT
Well for USA in the Vietnam war, I had the exact same problem. But I was able to get a rough idea of how USA's Navy think (based on modern placements of their numbered fleets, the US 6th fleet is based in Naples, Italy and is responsible for the Mediterranean during the Cold War and onward, for example). en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Sixth_FleetNow... the Royal Navy doesn't quite think exactly the same way, but America inherited the "Global Naval responsibility" from the British, and a lot of the American naval bases are former British naval bases. If you could have two maps and lay one down on top of the other, they overlap almost the same major routes, etc. Warning: I can't promise the Caribbean, NW Europe (where UK is), and the American coasts would be anywhere remotely similar. It's because those areas border the homelands of one or other and they have very different deployment/basing structures depending on whose home it is, make sense. Adding one more thing (this is the 3rd edit actually)... en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fleetsYou can look at how navies organized their ships into fleets, this may be quite helpful. Xakire probably has some additional information? I haven't really spoken with him, and he had wanted to be left alone anyhow. Back to the fleet thing, apparently mainly the USN, Germans, and the Japanese ever bothered to number some of their fleets or all of their fleets (USN). I checked the List of Fleets and saw the Mediterranean Fleet article, opened that article only to get stuck in the same problem again (how many ships were in the fleet?) so I "created" a solution for it out of necessity. Can't search forever. You're missing some things, even in that Mediterranean Fleet article too. Sir Andrew Cunningham took command of the fleet from Warspite on 3 September 1939, and under him the major formations of the Fleet were the 1st Battle Squadron (Warspite, Barham, and Malaya) 1st Cruiser Squadron (Devonshire, Shropshire, and Sussex), 3rd Cruiser Squadron (Arethusa, Penelope, Galatea), Rear Admiral John Tovey, with the 1st, 2nd, 3rd and 4th Destroyer Flotillas, and the aircraft carrier Glorious.[12]You can see mentions of major subgroups within the fleet. Plus, for my ACW research, I also had looked into the info based on the leading commanders to provide some further info, and sometimes it works. In this case, you'll want to check Adm. Cunningham en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andrew_Cunningham,_1st_Viscount_Cunningham_of_Hyndhope And naturally, for some VERY specific data of how many men, equipment, etc Order of Battle is usually very helpful, so I recommend that you look at some of the battles within that theater (plus the theater/campaign page itself) Case in point, I can give you the names of the 3 British aircraft carriers from this article: en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Taranto(And yes, only 1 carrier was directly involved as mentioned in the OOB) Then interestingly... Cunningham was given a very specific mention along with numerical strengths in the Aftermath section: |
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Post by Tolbethessar on Feb 2, 2020 21:20:52 GMT
You know what, idea. The Commonwealth didn't have as many ships at the start of the Second World War anyway as compared to the Italian Navy, and since I'm balancing the game anyway for both sides I'm making both the Navies of the same size (just like the Air Forces and Armies). The Naval Commanders (Axis and Allied) can name the ships the way they want. But they're gonna be the exact same number of ships, of the exact types (so for example, each side has 4 battleships in total, no more, no less, unless otherwise stated). Not a bad idea.  I've done some odd tweaks to my micro-RP such as anachronistically insert some earlier units or later units that wasn't quite historically accurate. In my ACW RP & Micro-RP, I simply had left off the specifics of naval matters to vague effects (such as reduction of available resources from overseas), so I basically left the whole thing out of the picture, but kept some effects to be felt upon land forces. So in your RP, setting a balanced approach of giving both the same fleets can work out if you like to. Probably 2 aircraft carriers, 4 battleships on each side (or give thr Axis a decisive advantage of submarines as in German U-boats, but no ACs and Italy with 2 extra BBs - they definitely had at least 6 BBs anyway). |
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Post by Frederick the Great on Feb 3, 2020 15:39:11 GMT
You know what, idea. The Commonwealth didn't have as many ships at the start of the Second World War anyway as compared to the Italian Navy, and since I'm balancing the game anyway for both sides I'm making both the Navies of the same size (just like the Air Forces and Armies). The Naval Commanders (Axis and Allied) can name the ships the way they want. But they're gonna be the exact same number of ships, of the exact types (so for example, each side has 4 battleships in total, no more, no less, unless otherwise stated). Not a bad idea. I've done some odd tweaks to my micro-RP such as anachronistically insert some earlier units or later units that wasn't quite historically accurate. In my ACW RP & Micro-RP, I simply had left off the specifics of naval matters to vague effects (such as reduction of available resources from overseas), so I basically left the whole thing out of the picture, but kept some effects to be felt upon land forces. So in your RP, setting a balanced approach of giving both the same fleets can work out if you like to. Probably 2 aircraft carriers, 4 battleships on each side (or give thr Axis a decisive advantage of submarines as in German U-boats, but no ACs and Italy with 2 extra BBs - they definitely had at least 6 BBs anyway). Nice ideas, I'll put them to good use. And yeah while Italy did have three carriers I believe only one was ever put to any use. I'll post a detailed view of all Axis and Allied units tonight (Air, Navy and Army). |
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Post by Tolbethessar on Feb 3, 2020 15:54:08 GMT
Not a bad idea. I've done some odd tweaks to my micro-RP such as anachronistically insert some earlier units or later units that wasn't quite historically accurate. In my ACW RP & Micro-RP, I simply had left off the specifics of naval matters to vague effects (such as reduction of available resources from overseas), so I basically left the whole thing out of the picture, but kept some effects to be felt upon land forces. So in your RP, setting a balanced approach of giving both the same fleets can work out if you like to. Probably 2 aircraft carriers, 4 battleships on each side (or give thr Axis a decisive advantage of submarines as in German U-boats, but no ACs and Italy with 2 extra BBs - they definitely had at least 6 BBs anyway). Nice ideas, I'll put them to good use. And yeah while Italy did have three carriers I believe only one was ever put to any use. I'll post a detailed view of all Axis and Allied units tonight (Air, Navy and Army). What are you talking about? It wasn't even a legitimate aircraft carrier. Giuseppe Miraglia was a Seaplane Tender. That's like calling a pre-dreadnought a "battleship in WW2", or calling the French tank, Renault FT, a "WW2 tank". Easily outclassed by the legit WW2 war machines, trust me.  As for the 2 actual aircraft carriers, neither of those two were even purpose-built (that's a considerable disadvantage in the later half of WW2), and neither of those were ready for wartime duty. Pulled from the wiki about the Italian navy: Aircraft carriers- Aquila
(modification of the liner Roma, built but never used), the article is incorrect. The ship-specific article explains that it wasn't completed in modifications, thus unable to launch aircrafts or land them anyway - Sparviero (modification of the liner Augustus, never completed)
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Post by Frederick the Great on Feb 3, 2020 16:16:08 GMT
Nice ideas, I'll put them to good use. And yeah while Italy did have three carriers I believe only one was ever put to any use. I'll post a detailed view of all Axis and Allied units tonight (Air, Navy and Army). What are you talking about? It wasn't even a legitimate aircraft carrier. Giuseppe Miraglia was a Seaplane Tender. That's like calling a pre-dreadnought a "battleship in WW2", or calling the French tank, Renault FT, a "WW2 tank". Easily outclassed by the legit WW2 war machines, trust me. As for the 2 actual aircraft carriers, neither of those two were even purpose-built (that's a considerable disadvantage in the later half of WW2), and neither of those were ready for wartime duty. Pulled from the wiki about the Italian navy: Aircraft carriers- Aquila
(modification of the liner Roma, built but never used), the article is incorrect. The ship-specific article explains that it wasn't completed in modifications, thus unable to launch aircrafts or land them anyway - Sparviero (modification of the liner Augustus, never completed)
Welp, that means the Allies have the advantage when it comes to carriers for sure. Though the German subs will be quite the headache for those carriers. Oh, and not to mention the Allies and Axis are mostly equal, (except for subs and capital ships). However, the tie-breaker will happen only in July 1940 (when the game starts). Oh that'll be fun! |
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Post by Tolbethessar on Feb 3, 2020 16:23:18 GMT
Yeah in WW2, other than Japan, the only major powers with massive naval aviation strength were the British and Americans (What about the French? Sure yeah, a lot better than everybody else (else than the major powers) else... but they were a middling, not massive tho). Nobody really could compare to the big 3 in this area.
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Post by Frederick the Great on Feb 3, 2020 16:27:34 GMT
Yeah in WW2, other than Japan, the only major powers with massive naval aviation strength were the British and Americans (What about the French? Sure yeah, a lot better than everybody else (else than the major powers) else... but they were a middling, not massive tho). Nobody really could compare to the big 3 in this area. Merica might send some ships over if things get worse, but in the start it's gonna be basically Italy vs UK on the sea |
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